Okay. Could that also become a European production site?

This is very much a possibility. I think it makes a lot of sense to be strongly rooted right here, where we offer our products and services. However, such a commitment must be made at the right time. Our current production capacity of 5,000 systems annually is sufficient for global demand at the moment. The question and timing of setting up production facilities here will very much depend on the political framework as well as order volumes. The European market for FC commercial vehicles does seem to be on the cusp of a breakout, but we need to wait a bit and see. In the medium and long term, however, we do expect Germany to be an important hub for us within the larger continent because Europe is really starting to accelerate.

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When you look here at Europe, where do you see the best framework conditions?

I think for fuel cell technology, if a company wants to enter the EU market, Germany is set to play a key role. We were fortunate to be able to establish solid supply chain partnerships here back in 2016. Then by 2018 we had already found our first end user customers, and in the same year we gained some visibility at the IAA Expo. This year, we have further intensified these co-operations, thereby helping to enable rapid growth our local partners in the FC sector. From hydrogen production to deployment of fuel cell technology we must work together to build a functioning and self-sustaining market.

Fig. 2: “there’s been much dialogue, and more and more companies are getting involved.”

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Are you mostly looking to connect with larger corporations, or do you also consider working with small businesses?

It’s interesting to see that the smaller, more agile companies are so willing to take the plunge. They want to see change, and despite the uncertainties and challenges, they are quite daring. As I mentioned, Refire also started out very small with just three automotive engineers as founders. We do work with larger industry players, for example, there’s a 3.5-tonne prototype FC transport van on show here at IAA Hall 12 that Schaeffler and Refire completed together. We also gave an introductory presentation here about a collaboration we have with Garrett. And Continental has been another such partner for our products. On the vehicle side, we’ve worked with Mitsubishi Fuso, a subsidiary of Daimler Truck, on their first FC truck. Regardless of the size of company, we know that we have to deliver good work with like-minded partners and that we can only succeed together.

How does market volatility affect Refire?

Like all market participants, we have to be fully cognizant of the changing landscape. We try to maintain flexible boundary conditions where we can, and prefer to focus on areas where we can make a positive impact – the confluence of policy, market, and technology. At the risk of repetition, we believe that means prioritizing co-operation. It also means helping to enable hydrogen ecosystem and market growth through knowledge sharing and facilitation of other relationships amongst active as well as potential stakeholders. Ultimately, if we can contribute sustainable value to our customers and partners, we expect to be able to thrive.

And finally, when do you expect a ramp-up to a considerable number of units?

Refire fuel cell systems currently power some 3,500 commercial vehicles on the road. When we talk about ramp-up, we can’t ignore the China market. So far, the country has plans to deploy 50,000 vehicles by 2025, which, in our opinion, is an achievable number. Parallel to this, other fleets are being built up around the world. Towards the second half of the decade, we expect to see quite a few more OEM projects and products hitting the roads in Europe, North America and Asia.

Thank you very much for your time and your responses.

Interviewer: Sven Geitmann